PowerCage + smith?

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  • June 3, 2008 at 8:54 am #995

    Hi all. Its time to upgrade my home gym, for my next bulk which is coming up quickly. I’m after something to complement free weight training, and thats a smith machine. I’ve also wanted a power cage to replace my rack (want more safety and fanciness)

    Anyone here know If power cages with attached-on smith machines exist? The only thing I found after surfing Google was a rack similar to mine right now, with a smith machine. Not only was it expensive, but I want to get away from the rack business.

    I’m also looking for a leg press, except one where I can hack squat on as well. I really want my quads to resemble small wild pigs.

    If anyone knows anything, I’m all eyes

    EDIT: http://www.samsfitness.com.au/product_info.php?pName=powertec-compact-leg-sled&cName=single-station-gym-equipment
    This looks like a great addition to my home gym Thoughts?

    http://www.cyber-market.com.au/product_info.php?cPath=58&products_id=261
    nice, but can it hold the weight

    I found the rack http://www.cyber-market.com.au/product_info.php?cPath=49&products_id=218
    Though not the asking price… ๐Ÿ‘ฟ

    June 3, 2008 at 9:26 am #6570

    One big question why do you want a smith machine? I wont go on about it yet I would just like to hear what you want out of it first.

    Secondly smith machines will be expensive as they are more intricate than nearly every other piece of weight training aids going around.

    June 3, 2008 at 10:04 am #6571

    @dave wrote:

    One big question why do you want a smith machine? I wont go on about it yet I would just like to hear what you want out of it first.

    To push more weight with benching, I like the safety aspect especially for decline benching (Never got into them because). Also to push more weight with shoulder pressing. It time to try new things and make a new mark for my next long bulk.

    On a side note, It seems to be cheaper to just buy a smith and cage separately.

    June 3, 2008 at 10:53 am #6572

    Ok, did you know smith machines reduce muscle activation due to the fact it stabilises the weight for you, so you lift more but are actually not placing your muscles under as much stress? Also did you know that a fixed position press with the smith machine places your shoulders into irregular movement pattern and will lead to anterior shoulder and eventually posterior shoulder problems, which take a FUKIN SHIT LOAD of time to correct (talking from experience but my problem comes from another source). Also did you know you can use a power rack with safety bars to lift better than a smith machine and still be safe from crushing your chest with the big weights?

    Sorry man but I am just so anti-smith machine its like a camouflaged weight lifting machine that should be smelted down and made into a power rack.

    June 3, 2008 at 11:15 am #6573

    @dave wrote:

    Ok, did you know smith machines reduce muscle activation due to the fact it stabilises the weight for you, so you lift more but are actually not placing your muscles under as much stress?

    Yeah, but to a certain point where the weight your using outweighs any negatives of not using muscle stabilisers

    @dave wrote:

    Also did you know that a fixed position press with the smith machine places your shoulders into irregular movement pattern and will lead to anterior shoulder and eventually posterior shoulder problems

    Hmm, Only thought that was with smith squats, with regards to f&%#ing your spine

    @dave wrote:

    Also did you know you can use a power rack with safety bars to lift better than a smith machine and still be safe from crushing your chest with the big weights?

    yup, you bet.

    @dave wrote:

    Sorry man but I am just so anti-smith machine its like a camouflaged weight lifting machine that should be smelted down and made into a power rack.

    Its cool, and thanks for the concern. I’m yet to here of anyone with shoulder problems from smiths. I’m also reading a lot of advanced routines (like DC training) where smiths can be used for pushing those big numbers, among others as well.

    Do you have any info I can read up, about the dangers of smiths? Anymore examples from members would be appreciated too. The powercage and legpress are all good to go as soon as I step outside to buy them…

    June 3, 2008 at 12:50 pm #6574

    Smith machines do not allow natural ranges of movement period, so squatting, benching everything done on it will be affected negatively.

    You may find that your stabilizers are actually one thing that may be holding you back, and using a smith machine just increases the problem.

    Shoulder problems are usually under reported as well as they are an inconvenance and annoying. They are also occur frequently in the population but they are really limiting to mobility and did I mention annoying.

    Also why dont you use that cool power rack you have an add in some heavy as shit board presses or floor presses, and do your declines in there to bring up the bench. Also what kind of training are you going for volume or low reps and what have you been doing?

    Be good to hear from a big bencher about this too.

    June 3, 2008 at 1:37 pm #6575

    Yup, I’ve done some reading and changed my mind on the smith.
    This Is what its coming down to…

    http://www.cyber-market.com.au/product_info.php?cPath=58&products_id=232
    Cage

    http://www.cyber-market.com.au/product_info.php?cPath=58&products_id=261

    OR

    http://www.samsfitness.com.au/product_info.php?pName=powertec-compact-leg-sled&cName=single-station-gym-equipment

    for legs

    With the hack squat machine, are these ok for the back, or Is It too much like a smith machine when squatting it? I can hit my calves as well on both of those too with a block.

    Opinions or disagreements on equipment, I’m happy to hear it.

    PS: those press’s you mentioned dave look good and worth trying.

    June 4, 2008 at 9:02 am #6576

    If you want to bring up your bench look into powerlifters training, its 1 of the 3 lifts and they know how to make it better, you can increase your strength and then the size will come with and after that.

    The power rack looks good, and the price seems not bad (though I didnt check in with all the particulars) check out KM’s info for when he brought a power rack, compare and constrast your price and quality, he might even have some advice.

    A leg press is not that great for the back as it is similar in locking out natural movements but it is not as bad as a smith machine, though its not good. If you find that you can not get the same work from deadlifts, sumo deadlifts, single leg squats, front squats, back squats, lunges, power clean, snatches, box squats, step ups, hack squats, calf raises, elevated calf raises etc then investing a whole whopping 1000 is a good idea. Personally I think you can get all the work just from a barbell, bodyweight (backpack with plates as it gets easier) and dumbbells. You will have the safety of the power rack incase anything goes wrong and have a LOT more flexibility in how you train than being stuck on a leg press.

    Also on board presses. Firstly if for size. If you are a shoulder/tricep dominant person like KM board presses and the like will not help build that size in the pecs and will just increase your lower chest development (I am the same). Now for strength. The triceps are probably the most important muscle in the bench press due to their range of motion compared the the fan based pecs which have a very small contractile range. Both are important but I believe you can increase your bench better through tricep and shoulder development better than focussing on the chest (though all 3 are important in the long run and the chest should not be neglected).

    June 4, 2008 at 10:34 am #6577

    My benching Isn’t a huge problem, It will go up when I bulk again. I’m holding onto my strength with it as well during this cut which has been good. Thanks for your advice to, I’ll definetly be adding in those presses next bulk.

    I still want to get a leg press to expand my leg day and untap more growth. My legs are definetly not the size they should be for someone who can squat a best of 150kgs 6 times on a leg day. I want to implement some olskool techniques like 20reps squats and presses next bulk as well. My knee joints are great, I’ve never had issues with them ever, so its do or die.

    Just tossing up which press would be the best.

    PS: the press can double as a calve raiser.

    June 4, 2008 at 10:53 am #6578

    If you have the money to spare go for it. If its tight and you could use it on something else then think about sticking to other exercises but it sounds like you have some money to go round. And yes leg presses do make a good calf raise got to agree with that.

    June 5, 2008 at 4:39 am #6579

    UB, those powerlifters use a different technique to get bigger lifts, it involves raising your butt off the bench & arching the whole torso. This also shortens the length of the press movement, but allows more weight as it starts using the back muscles and the whole chain down to the hams for the lifting strength. Your weights will go up incredibly by learning this method. Westside Gym website in the US, has pdf file info on the exact technique, and on other powerlifting info’. DA
    P.S Use a spotter or at second best a rack, for this.

    June 5, 2008 at 5:03 am #6580

    One problem with powerlifters technique for a bodybuilder is they are working at lower the biomechanical disadvantages to increase the lift. I do not bench anymore but when I did I took what is good and made sure I molded it to fit my goals and threw out the rest. If you use the range of motion shortening techniques you will lose negate your muscualr development (i am assuming this is most important to you). Go through the techniques and you will understand what you should use and what you shouldnt.

    By the way we need to change your username as you have made some really great gains from when you started oh so long ago.

    June 5, 2008 at 8:18 am #6581

    Unbuff-Smith machines are for poofs or anyone who likes Carson Kressley! ๐Ÿ˜†

    June 5, 2008 at 8:36 am #6582

    @IAN wrote:

    Unbuff-Smith machines are for poofs or anyone who likes Carson Kressley! ๐Ÿ˜†

    wow, well since you mentioned carson I definetly won’t be getting a smith. ๐Ÿ˜ฏ

    June 5, 2008 at 8:57 am #6583

    wow I wrote all those words and Ian goes and summarizes it in one sentence, now thats talent.

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